Law and Software

live blogging the N-400 and the naturalization process

[March, 2013] By Andy Bartlett. Filed under: Immigration Law,law,live blogging

I am one of a small number of people who got to swear to uphold the U.S. Constitution as a legal document, and not as part of an oath of allegiance to the United States. I was an officer of the court in a country that is my home, but I was not a citizen. Theoretically, I could have defended a client’s right to vote, even though I had no such right. But I crossed the five year wait line. And applied for citizenship. This post is a live blog of the application process. 98 days from application to oath ceremony. And even though I help many through the process nowadays as a community immigration lawyer, your first time is a fond memory that stays with you…  Lets wind the clock back to Day 1…

I’m going to blog the process.  I will update this blog entry over the weeks and months ahead, and document what happens. A Russian friend went through it all recently and it took four months from application to oath. Mine is a weird case. I belong to a bunch of associations.. all bar associations. I am a licensed attorney, I spent three of the 5 wait years at a top-tier law school, I ticked no in all the right places, and yes in all the other right places.  And I’ve only been out of the country for about 40 days – to help my daughter through a math exam and to see my grown up sons, and a new granddaughter. That’s the background. Not very interesting. What’ll be interesting is the process. The details. I don’t know what to expect. I know what the process looks like on paper, what the forms are like, and I’ve heard war stories. But I don’t know what to expect. That’s what this extended blog post will be about.

Let’s start at the beginning.

1. (last week) I downloaded the N-400 forms (I searched for “USCIS N-400 with Google. That’s the easiest way to get to the right place). I have filled out the forms a number of times at citizenship workshops, but for other people. I had to download the latest version of Acrobat Reader, but that let me read and complete the form on the computer. No red flags that I could see. The only challenge was to track the dates I had been out of the country. Fortunately I had bought air tickets via Orbitz, and the confirmations were still in my email.

I went down to the local photo shop, and the lady who took the two passport photos has one year more to wait before she can apply. We aliens are everywhere :). I wrote a check, made out to the Department of Homeland Security – for $680 – which includes “biometrics” and then sent the forms to the USCIS at Phoenix via Fedex. I included the G-1145 form at the top of the packet – that allows them to notify me by email that they have accepted the package. That was last Wednesday evening. Call it Day 1.

Day 6 (Monday) – with an intervening weekend – I receive the email from a friendly guy called He tells me:

Your case has been accepted and routed to the USCIS National Benefits Center for processing. Within 7-10 days by standard mail you will receive your official Receipt Notice

This won’t be a very fast live blog. Maybe there’ll be more in 7-10 days.

Also on Day 6 (just noticed) USCIS cashed the payment check with ACH electronic funds transfer. Probably before telling me the case was accepted.

Day 8. The I-797C Notice of Action – the “official Receipt Notice” –  arrives. the notice date was Day 3 – but that was a Friday. I didn’t have to wait 7-10 days after all.

Day 10. Another I-797C Notice. This time the appointment for biometrics. This is all happening very very fast. Biometrics day will be on Day 28. At Fingerprints for the FBI check. My second check in a year (they run the check for your state bar “moral character” evaluation as well). The important small print is

the photo taken may be used on your naturalization certificate

In other words, look presentable.

Day 28. 8am appointment and a 45 minute drive in good traffic to get there. For biometrics. i.e. prints and mugshot. Half a dozen other people waiting outside the door when it opened at 8. I did a little pro-bono lawyering – really just giving “the talk” to someone who was there to get her green card renewed – everyone else in her family are already citizens. You take such a risk by staying as an LPR. The whole thing took about half an hour. Staff were very helpful to everyone. Now, I suppose, I just wait.

Day 43: “My Case Status” at reports that I have been scheduled for interview. Waiting for the notice.

Day 49: I have the interview date. It will be on Day 79 of the process. 11 weeks from mailing the application to getting an interview. I’m impressed.

Day 79 happened.

Lovely sunny day. Found the last parking place at Larkspur Landing for the 11.10 ferry to San Francisco. Walked from the Embarcadero to Sansome St. 12.30 seems like a nice time to have an appointment. Very few people there. None of the queues I remember from my early morning green card interview. Just a few minutes after my scheduled time, I was called in for interview.

The USCIS officer was very friendly. Which is one of the best ways to extract information. I was sworn in, she checked my documents, and then ran the “test.” I noticed one family in the waiting room studying for the questions. Yes I know what the supreme law of the land is, what an amendment is, who vetoes bills, who were the bad guys in world war two, what you pledge allegiance to, and where Jerry Brown works. Then she talked me through my history and the application form – and it was done. 30 minutes and she ticked the box that said Congratulations. They only recommend, but it’s a step forward.

I was surprised how much they all put you at your ease and there is no sense of confrontation or us and them formality – there was that feeling five years ago. Not only could I ask her questions (about my daughter’s possible status as an immediate relative, and also about a friend’s issue with FNU and GNU – not the free software foundation – and worth a separate blog post). I left the room feeling that it had been a very special moment. One that I would not forget. Thank you Ms. Officer.

Now more waiting.

But only until Day 86. It took 1 week for them to process the interview data, approve it (yay) and set a date for an oath ceremony. Which should be at the Paramount in Oakland. My Case Status” at reports that I have been scheduled for the final step in the process. Just 12 and a half weeks.



And on Day 90 I get the Form N-445 – Notice of Naturalization Oath Ceremony – it will all be over on Day 98. At the Paramount.

The Oath Ceremony at the Paramount in Oakland was extraordinary.

It was wonderfully well organized. I arrived just before 9.15am expecting queues outside. Instead, you go straight in – there are about a dozen ushers who check your paperwork and direct you to one of 10 entrances. And each entrance is for a particular section of the auditorium. A couple of minutes after arriving, I was in my seat, in section 10. I had given up my green card “what is this?” “it is my OLD green card?” “why don’t you need it?”

There were 1079 applicants, from 104 countries. And maybe three times as many guests – guests all went upstairs  into the gallery. It was a ceremony. It was well planned. Funny at times. And all over by 10.40am.

When you go through the process you have no sense of anyone else doing the same. You fill out your forms, alone. You attend your interview, mostly alone. And then you reach the ceremony with 1078 other people. That is the one big surprise. When you sent your packet to USCIS on day 1, they probably received 50 others on the same day from your region. And many of those people are in the auditorium with you at the end. It’s a lonely road, but you are not alone.

I hope they never replace the ceremony with a welcome email. The Paramount became our port of entry. We all arrived together. At the same time on the same day. Just like those that poured into Ellis Island off the ships in the black and white photographs.

And this evening I registered to vote.

Don’t wait. Don’t put it off. Make sure you are safe first. Make sure there are no red flags.

Just do it.

p.s. September 2015.

Nowadays I help people get citizenship. And their experiences – at least in the Bay Area – have been very similar to mine. There are just a few things I want to add to the original post – with hindsight. First is that the interview is non-adversarial. Usually it becomes a fond memory for the applicant. Second is that you must bring originals of paperwork to the interview – particularly when they are court dispositions, as they will RFE you for them if you don’t, and that can cause an anxious few weeks wait – or longer. Third, the first thing they do is check that you are still entitled to your green card – and that’s why you need to be careful. If you have law enforcement issues, if you have spent significant time abroad – even years and years ago, or if there is any peculiarity with how you got your green card, you should get professional advice. Fourth, remember they want to know about traffic citations – other than parking – as well as arrests etc. And fifth, without citizenship you can lose your card at any time. Particularly if you plan to spend time abroad.

When you apply for your first US Passport, get a passport card as well. After the oath ceremony you no longer have a green card. But you are still foreign sounding and you may have to prove your status occasionally. The passport card can replace your old green card as proof that you are here lawfully.

Finally, remember that even if your home country does not allow dual citizenship, they often have special status for those who naturalize. So you may lose the right to vote back home, but you may still be able to travel there freely, work etc. Before you decide not to apply for US Citizenship check with your embassy about what the real cost is.

27 Responses to “live blogging the N-400 and the naturalization process”

  1. Cherry Says:

    Thank you for sharing your experience here. It gives me more confidence in the process, as I am about to submit the N400 after being a LPR for some 20 years. Thank you again for taking the time and effort to record your own process.

  2. Jay Says:

    Hi Andy,

    First of all, thanks for sharing your experience. I have a quick question that you might be able to answer. I submitted my application and have received the appointment for biometrics (fingerprinting and all). I was wondering if I can just walk-in before my set appointment date since I’m free a week before my appointment. Someone informed me it was okay basing on his experience in San Marcos but how about in San Francisco? We’re they strict about it? I called the national USCIS number but they don’t have an answer and I don’t have the San Francisco USCIS office number.

  3. admin Says:

    (I replied privately to the email address you gave)

  4. shital Says:

    Thanks for sharing your detailed experience of Naturalization Process. It helps….I have a question, unfortunately I submitted my application without signing the application form N 400. I realized as soon as i dropped the packed and i tried to recall but it was not successful with USPS. Should I drop another application form as i am sure the other application is going to be rejected.

  5. admin Says:

    [not legal advice – just a comment about my experience] The form will be returned to you. I have never (yet) submitted an unsigned form, but with fee waivers, if you don’t give everything they need, they send back the whole packet within a couple of weeks, and don’t put it in the system – so you can’t just send an update – there isn’t a case file to put the update in. Once your case is in the system and you have a case number, then you can update. But if there is something missing, they will make an RFE and that’s an easier way of getting the documentation to them than hoping that the mailroom can process your new material.

  6. BT Says:

    Wanted to post it so that if someone is in similar problem.

    So I got notice for fingerprint on 4/11/2014 for appointment on 4/29/2014.

    I was worried as I was going out of country on 4/25/14 and would have to reschedule the appointment.

    Instead I just walked in the office on 4/14/2014 and asked them if they can do the finger printing today and they said yes they are not that busy and can do it.

    Thanks to them I don’t have to worry about it.

  7. admin Says:

    Yes the people who work for the service are nice. And they try to be helpful whenever possible.

  8. Raman Says:

    Great blog post. I have 2 questions for the blog’s author:
    (1) Was yours an employment based/marriage based Naturalization?
    (2) Did you have to submit W-2s for the past 5 years

  9. admin Says:

    Thank you. I got my green card EB1C through employment. They do talk about all of your history with you – including how you got your green card, and what happened afterwards – but they do that as a final check on whether there was fraud in the process. And it is a gentle conversation. My situation was unusual – during those five years I went to law school and passed the bar – but I also kept the local office running over that period. I offered no W-2 evidence, but I had filed my taxes. As long as you had a real employer-employee relationship during your green card application, and did work for some (short) period afterwards (at will employment on a GC is ‘indefinite’) then it is not an issue. It is always wise to have a conversation with an attorney before natz – to make sure there are no red flags and your green card is not at risk.

  10. admin Says:

    Mine was after 5 years. Not through marriage. You do not submit W-2s. Check the n-400 instructions to see if any special instructions relate to your case. In particular those who are going for the 3 year quickie have some extra evidence they need to provide.

  11. amna Says:

    Hi. Thanks for this great post. I was just wondering..did u send off ur n400 application to a lockbox address through fedex? Isnt tht a courier service for which they have given a separate mailing address? We did husband sent out his application to phoenix lockbox through UPS. Its been over 2 weeks and we have not been notified through email or text (as we included a G 1145). Really frustrated.

  12. admin Says:

    Hi. Hopefully all went well. In the filing instructions they always give a mail address and a courier address. If you used the right address and your tracking information shows it was delivered, then be patient. Their mailroom is unimaginably busy.

  13. Daniyal Says:

    My case status shows that my case is still in a queue for interview scheduling since 3rd June 2014. What am I supposed to do? When I called the service center I was given a long tracking code. But, don’t know where to enter that. I would appreciate if you help

  14. admin Says:

    I didn’t see your comment at the time. The tracking code is usually the application receipt code, and you can go to and “check my case status” by entering the code.

  15. Jessica Says:

    I am applying to become a citizen. I was divorced last year and I still have my married name. I am not sure if I should change my name before I file for citizenship because:

    1. it would delay the process
    2. Additional expenses
    3. or if that option is afforded in the “change your name” option

  16. admin Says:

    I’m sorry I didn’t see this comment when you posted it. This isn’t the place to get legal advice. Generally, the “change your name” option does not mean that USCIS can change your name. They can’t. If you bring your name change papers from the court to your interview, they will honor it. And if you are in the district of one of the (getting fewer) USCIS field offices that can use a federal judge to perform an oath ceremony, then she can do the name change when you take the oath – and you don’t have to go through the courts. Name change in the courts can take 3-6 months, and usually does not require you to attend a hearing.

  17. Arvind Says:

    Thank you. Most of the applicants are NOT lucky like you. I am New Yorker,applied in 26th May,2014. The notice was bio metric was sent during the heavy snow fall in Jan,mail was delayed and got it just one day before the finger scanning appointment. I had to take a flight from west coast ( on job work at west coast),landed &submitted myself for the finger scanning. After 63 days I was informed that the scanning was not accepted by the FBI and directed to re do it again.which was done 2 weeks back and nothing yet. The officer was telling me some how their scanning computer is not working properly on the day( 30th March,2015) of my second scanning and he said the FBI might reject it again and i have to go places where i lived all these years. That means, I am punished for their scanning fault and now it seems I have to travel all the places i lived which almost west coast CA, South in Florida,East in NY and Midwest in thing its fair in my case,
    Lucky you are and
    Unlucky we are

    Thank you

  18. admin Says:

    I hope you finally got lucky. Maybe you’ll come back and continue the story and share the ending. I am in California, and my experience described here is very similar to the experience of every one of my clients who goes through natz. So I think it lucky bay area folks.

  19. lisa Says:

    Thanks for sharing your experience, it is very helpful to us.

    My question is regarding citations-i have a few around expired tabs :(. I paid the fine and the status is closed. However when filing and sending my n400 should i send it evidence? right now I am only listing all the citations (they are all traffic related i.e expired tabs). Should I send in evidence?

    also around the green card, I am divorced (more than 10 years from that person). What questions did they ask you around your gc? Thank you again.

  20. admin Says:

    I’ve emailed you a full response – if anyone is reading this, please don’t ask time-sensitive questions here, because I don’t always see your comment in time. a) no. b) they just want to know that you got your green card (or got your conditions lifted) properly and there was no fraud. Good luck!

  21. lisa Says:

    Thank you very much. That makes me feel better 🙂

  22. RK Says:

    my form N-400 was received by USCIS on 09/28/2015, my wife application was also completed by me and was recieved same day. now she has gone through the entire process in exactly 6 months while I haven’t heard anthing at all. wondering if others have similar experience or is this really unusual ?

  23. admin Says:

    Did you go for biometrics? Did they cash your check?

  24. paulina siwak Says:


    I would love to apply for my citizenship but have two questions which prevent me from doing so.

    1. my husband was previously married, but doesn’t remember his former spouses DOB. the application is asking for it (which I have no idea why). What should I do?

    2. As some point I was in removal proceedings. What is the best way of documenting something like that. I don’t want to get denied for something that has happened in the past and it was resolved.

    Thank you for any Suggestions.

  25. admin Says:

    for the DOB “not known” is a fair response if true. Anyone who has been in removal proceedings would be wise to talk with a lawyer – most likely all this was resolved before you got your green card but you wouldn’t want them to uncover an issue as they review the papers for natz.

  26. redbull Says:

    Sent N-400 in December, 2014. Now is August, 2016. It’s been 1 year and 9 month already. Still not interviewed. USCIS says background check does not completed, and they can not proceed before it will be done. Somebody know any rules or law about proceeding time?

  27. admin Says:

    You might want to consult with a lawyer – where you can give personal details in confidence (don’t give any here) – to see just how unreasonable this delay is. But maybe you will get a comment from someone who was in a similar situation and it was resolved.

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